Tandy Plainsman Boot pattern

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Peter Remling
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Re: Tandy Plainsman Boot pattern

Postby Peter Remling » Tue Jan 09, 2018 2:25 am

Welcome Susan ! I just checked to see it there was a downloadable copy...nope. There are several copies at other sites, most run about the same as AbeBooks.

Have you made any and do you have some pics ?
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Re: Tandy Plainsman Boot pattern

Postby Susan Baker » Tue Jan 09, 2018 5:47 pm

Sorry, no pics, and the shoes I made wore out long before I bought my first computer.
My aim in joining this forum was just to let people know that there was a book out there that could help them to make their own shoes in the style they want.
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Re: Tandy Plainsman Boot pattern

Postby kleenur » Tue Jan 09, 2018 6:57 pm

I'm super glad someone Necroed this thread! Boots have been a thing I've been thinking about, and after some research this plainsmen pattern seems to fit in pretty well from both an historical and Tolkienian Fantasy perspective. Certainly they seem to need a bit of modification, primarily that neither Tolkien's Rangers nor 12th-14th century English Yeoman would have worn tassels on their boots, but other than that they are certainly plausible. My main question is for anyone who's made them what kinds of leather did you use for both the soles, and the uppers? Tandy sells a sole leather, and that seems legit, but I don't quite know what to use for the uppers. I was thinking some sort of Latigo, or even oiled leather would be appropriate as I don't know that buckskin would be exactly right.
"All that is gold does not glitter,
Not all those who wander are lost;
The old that is strong does not wither,
Deep roots are not reached by the frost."


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Re: Tandy Plainsman Boot pattern

Postby Elleth » Wed Jan 10, 2018 1:45 pm

Cool!

I'm not aware of any pre-Columbian Euro boot patterns that use that construction for the foot, but it's clearly a practical pattern, and it definitely answers to the description "high boots of supple leather."

I'd personally be tempted to go with a fairly light vegetable tanned cowhide or fairly heavy vegetable tanned goathide for the uppers, given a period dubbining. But to date I've only had commerical boots that use off-the-shelf modern tanned stuff, and they do okay.

I know Greg made his own boots, but I don't recall what he used?
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Re: Tandy Plainsman Boot pattern

Postby Ringulf » Wed Jan 10, 2018 4:58 pm

The Kodiak or bison would be great. I have also seen that done in a water= Boiled treatment that makes them very tough and lets them break in kinda slowly. Not as supple of course but extremely tough and durable. The pair of Baltics I am working on may get that as they are to be Riding boots. I have a pair of Norman cavalry style boots that damn neer saved my foot just a few months ago. I did not stick the dismount and ended on my back on the ground under a 17 hand mare. She did her best not to step on me but came squarely down on my right foot. The boots with this treatment saved my foot from a good squashing. got right back up on her and finished the day. no bad injury at all, just a little spot on the big toenail that is finding its way to the end. I was very happy to have been wearing them.
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Re: Tandy Plainsman Boot pattern

Postby Eric C » Fri Jan 12, 2018 3:06 am

kleenur wrote:I'm super glad someone Necroed this thread! Boots have been a thing I've been thinking about, and after some research this plainsmen pattern seems to fit in pretty well from both an historical and Tolkienian Fantasy perspective. Certainly they seem to need a bit of modification, primarily that neither Tolkien's Rangers nor 12th-14th century English Yeoman would have worn tassels on their boots, but other than that they are certainly plausible. My main question is for anyone who's made them what kinds of leather did you use for both the soles, and the uppers? Tandy sells a sole leather, and that seems legit, but I don't quite know what to use for the uppers. I was thinking some sort of Latigo, or even oiled leather would be appropriate as I don't know that buckskin would be exactly right.


It was quite a while ago that I made my boots. The ones I made for my ranger kit didn't have the tassels at the top. The Plainsman's pattern didn't call for it and I wouldn't have done it anyway. As for the leather, it is all made of vegetable tanned 3 oz (I think) leather. They are incredibly comfortable and still going strong. But as I said, they are no fun for crossing rocks unless your feet are tougher than mine. For a first boot, these are great and they are simple. I would love to upgrade. But 1) leather's not cheap and 2) I'm a bit intimidated by something more complicated. If your boots are not right, not only could you take yourself out of a trek, you could damage your feet or your back for life. So be careful.
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Re: Tandy Plainsman Boot pattern

Postby kleenur » Fri Jan 12, 2018 1:47 pm

Thanks for the input. I agree that boots are crucial. Based on everything I've seen here and on Leatherworker.net (lots of knowledge, but the community is not overly helpful to noobs) I think when I make them I will do the plainsmen style boot using 12-13 oz sole leather for the soles, and something in the 5-7 oz. range for the rest. I haven't yet decided weather I will do cowhide for the whole boot or use deer hide for the uppers. I'm going to buy the pattern today, but won't get the leather for a while because it ain't cheap!
"All that is gold does not glitter,
Not all those who wander are lost;
The old that is strong does not wither,
Deep roots are not reached by the frost."


-J.R.R Tolkien
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Re: Tandy Plainsman Boot pattern

Postby Taurinor » Fri Jan 12, 2018 2:26 pm

kleenur wrote:Boots have been a thing I've been thinking about, and after some research this plainsmen pattern seems to fit in pretty well from both an historical and Tolkienian Fantasy perspective. Certainly they seem to need a bit of modification, primarily that neither Tolkien's Rangers nor 12th-14th century English Yeoman would have worn tassels on their boots, but other than that they are certainly plausible.


As Elleth said, they should work quite well for Middle-earth Ranger-ing (Eric's look very sharp!), but 12th-14th century European shoes were constructed quite differently. That being said, they would look a sight better than the modern shoes or costume boots a fair few SCAdians wear to events, and I don't think anyone would give you a hard time about them at an event, but if you're looking for something that will fit Middle-earth and be historically accurate to medieval Europe, you may want to consider something different. Like you said, leather is expensive, and it's always frustrating when you make something and find out it's not quite right afterwards!
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Re: Tandy Plainsman Boot pattern

Postby kleenur » Fri Jan 12, 2018 3:57 pm

Taurinor wrote:
kleenur wrote:Boots have been a thing I've been thinking about, and after some research this plainsmen pattern seems to fit in pretty well from both an historical and Tolkienian Fantasy perspective. Certainly they seem to need a bit of modification, primarily that neither Tolkien's Rangers nor 12th-14th century English Yeoman would have worn tassels on their boots, but other than that they are certainly plausible.


As Elleth said, they should work quite well for Middle-earth Ranger-ing (Eric's look very sharp!), but 12th-14th century European shoes were constructed quite differently. That being said, they would look a sight better than the modern shoes or costume boots a fair few SCAdians wear to events, and I don't think anyone would give you a hard time about them at an event, but if you're looking for something that will fit Middle-earth and be historically accurate to medieval Europe, you may want to consider something different. Like you said, leather is expensive, and it's always frustrating when you make something and find out it's not quite right afterwards!



The SCAdians I hang out with are not very picky. As long as it doesn't look obviously modern then they don't even notice it. I've looked at some historical examples, and there were certainly higher "boots" that laced in the front. As far as nitty gritty construction patterns are concerned I haven't found any examples in my research. Basically, my thinking is "This will work". Leather is certainly expensive, but the good news is that the leather I buy for this first pair should do for several pairs. We'll see what happens. When I make them I will post about the process in great detail somewhere on the internet.

I don't think my SCA persona will be completely accurate anyway. First I'll have a recurve, not a longbow. Second, there really isn't any way I'm wearing hose. The mostly exposed nether regions are not something I will ever be comfortable with! Also, I'm far more interested in having a solid ranger kit than a completely accurate SCA one.
"All that is gold does not glitter,
Not all those who wander are lost;
The old that is strong does not wither,
Deep roots are not reached by the frost."


-J.R.R Tolkien
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Re: Tandy Plainsman Boot pattern

Postby Taurinor » Fri Jan 12, 2018 4:28 pm

kleenur wrote:I've looked at some historical examples, and there were certainly higher "boots" that laced in the front. As far as nitty gritty construction patterns are concerned I haven't found any examples in my research.

Yep, that style of upper seems to show up over a pretty wide range of dates and places! It's the vamp and sole construction that really differ. If you're interested, Carlson's Footwear of the Middle Ages site has schematics for a bunch of different styles. I do think it would be hard to find a premade, ready-to-follow pattern, though.

kleenur wrote:Second, there really isn't any way I'm wearing hose. The mostly exposed nether regions are not something I will ever be comfortable with!

That's a shame! Braies and chausses are quite comfortable, and before you get into the late 14th century, really pretty baggy and modest. The Sarah Thursfield "tube" construction makes for great mobility and flexibility out in the woods! The Professor does specify breeches for northern men in Letter 211, though, so you won't run into that problem for Middle-earth.

When I make them I will post about the process in great detail somewhere on the internet.

Awesome! Looking forward to following your progress!
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Elleth
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Re: Tandy Plainsman Boot pattern

Postby Elleth » Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:08 pm

Oh... I love this one!
SHOE30.GIF
SHOE30.GIF (3.03 KiB) Viewed 1399 times

http://www.personal.utulsa.edu/~marc-ca ... SHOE30.HTM

That broad idea but knee-ish height is pretty much exactly how I picture the Rangers' footwear. :)

I really like the "spine" on the back of Armstreet's ankle boots though, and I think if and when I join you guys in the bootmaking game I'll have to try it:
https://armstreet.com/store/footwear/br ... ss-accents


Regarding SCA and clothing: my memory of most SCA groups I've run into that their garb references and common culture come from a theatrical costuming background*. As such, I'd not expect things made to SCA standard to necessarily perform as well in real daily wear than those made of historically correct materials to historically correct patterns - hence I'd echo Taurinor in saying just 'cause what you've seen in the SCA garb handouts don't strike your fancy, don't be hasty in discounting the real things.




(* And that common culture coalesced something like 40 years ago loooooong before the net and awesome books we have today were available, and they did amazing things with what they had.)
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Re: Tandy Plainsman Boot pattern

Postby Worldwalker » Fri Sep 14, 2018 1:21 pm

I have the Plainsman pattern, and have made a pair. I used deerskin that I inherited from my grandparents. I didn't like the fringe around the top, so I did not include it in my finished boots. Instead of using a rotary punch to make holes and latigo to construct the boots, I used a 4-prong punch to make small holes and then sewed the boots together with basic leather thread. The only latigo I used was for the laces.

Since the soles are deerskin, they cannot take much abuse and I have not worn them much.

The benefit of this pattern though is that the soles can easily be removed from the boot and replaced. I plan on replacing the soles with ones made of a thicker leather or with pigskin with thick leather insoles.

Kortoso, instead of using the insole pattern pieces that come with the pattern, trace your feet and make your own. I encountered the same problem as you, since my feet are 2 sizes too wide for their length.

As to there being an error in the pattern, I think I saw something about it in a thread over at bushcraftusa.com on the plainsman boot pattern from 2009-2010. If I can find it again, I let you fellow rangers know what it is.
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